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View Full Version : Obama getting ready to give away the farm down in Mexico


Mannlicher
16th April 2009, 18:15
http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20090416/ap_on_go_pr_wh/lt_obama_mexico
The President wants to kick start a 1997 treaty that has not been approved here. This will put our gun rights in serious danger of being trumped by a treaty with foreign countries that have no gun rights.

MEXICO CITY – Confronting a security threat on America's doorstep, President Barack Obama pledged Thursday in Mexico to help a deeply troubled neighbor in its battle against drugs and violence, including action to slow the dangerous flow of weapons from the United States.

"At a time when the Mexican government has so courageously taken on the drug cartels that have plagued both sides of the border," Obama said, the U.S. must join "in dealing with the flow of guns and cash south."

Obama spoke at the start of a swift visit to underscore U.S. solidarity.

Mexican President Felipe Calderon welcomed Obama to the presidential residence, Los Pinos, with an acknowledgment of the challenges: "My country is immersed in a historic transformation process. We live a robust democracy, which is also plural. We're also facing firmly the costs of the struggles in order to turn Mexico into a safer country."
The Organization of American States adopted the weapons treaty in 1997 as a way to curtail dealing in illicit firearms throughout Latin America. Since then, 33 countries have signed the treaty, and 24 have ratified it. Former President Bill Clinton signed the treaty on Nov. 14, 1997, one day after it was endorsed by the OAS.

The Clinton administration submitted the 13-page treaty to the Senate for ratification the following year, but it has languished in the Foreign Relations Committee without action since then.

Clinton said at the time that the treaty would "advance important U.S. government interests and would enhance hemispheric security by obstructing the illicit flow of weapons to criminals such as terrorists and drug traffickers."

Countries ratifying the treaty agree to make the manufacture or trafficking in illegal firearms a criminal offense, to track the export, import and transit of all firearms and to share information with law enforcement officials in other countries who are investigating arms trafficking.

Rich-D
16th April 2009, 20:12
The one good point that sticks out in the link you posted, is that Obama backed off in his quest to reinstate the AWB Ban.


MEXICO CITY – Confronting a Mexican drug war that is "sowing chaos in our communities," President Barack Obama signaled Thursday he will not seek the reinstatement of a U.S. assault weapons ban but instead step up enforcement of existing laws banning the transfer of such guns across the border.

KimberCowboy1911
16th April 2009, 20:30
This may be that I'm lacking in some general info about the treaty, but how will my 2a rights be effected if I am not trafficking weapons accross the boarders and dealing to criminals? I understand it makes the manufacture of illegal weapons a criminal offense, but isn't manufacturing a weapon deemed illegal in the US already a felony? I can see how that can be used against us on a domestic level if they add guns to the illegal list, but I can't see how any of those 33 countries will have a bearing on us domestically. I guess it could be a backdoor approach to track weapons here, but that would be a stretch and it wouldn't happen without a huge fight, at least from me.

I also agree with Rich in that it's nice to hear the administration publically back off the AWB.

joffe
16th April 2009, 21:49
http://michaelbane.blogspot.com/2009/04/here-we-go-boys-girls.html

This treaty is definitely a problem, especially for home manufactures, hand loaders, and accessory makers. Let’s take a look at some of the provisions that should worry us. The treaty bans “illicit manufacturing” of firearms, defined as: ...the manufacture or assembly of firearms, ammunition, explosives, and other related materials: a. from components or parts illicitly trafficked; or b. without a license from a competent governmental authority of the State Party where the manufacture or assembly takes place; or c. without marking the firearms that require marking at the time of manufacturing. This would seem to require a government license for home building, assembling from parts, and quite likely many types of repairs and customizations. And here’s the really scary part, it defines “other related materials” this way: “any component, part, or replacement part of a firearm, or an accessory which can be attached to a firearm.” This would make all people who make accessories that attach to a firearm to have a license. It would presumably also ban home manufacture of these items without a government license. Do you own trigger jobs? Reload your own ammunition? Not anymore, not without a government license!

flyfish
16th April 2009, 21:50
Great news on Obama backing off the AWB reinstatement. He must be feeling a little political heat on this issue or he certainly would have went ahead with reinstatement to appease his cronies. Let's hope he sticks to it!

kenhwind
16th April 2009, 22:32
If the US Senate ratifies any international treaty in supersedes any Constitutional Right.

Clinton said at the time that the treaty would "advance important U.S. government interests and would enhance hemispheric security by obstructing the illicit flow of weapons to criminals such as terrorists and drug traffickers."
This is already illegal in the USA.

d90king
16th April 2009, 22:48
Some of this stuff has been around for years and has languished for over a decade and cant even make it out of committee. It is very difficult to actually get the support that you would need to get this through congress. The language in this has zero chance of passing a vote. In the current climate he can't commit the political energy to push this at this time.

The problem with "treaty's" and some bills is that they let them sit around until they become "popular" enough to pass.

IMHO he had a soapbox and told them what they wanted to hear.

Rich-D
16th April 2009, 23:20
"We know that it is a politically delicate topic because Americans truly cherish their constitutional rights," Calderon said.


Rich

d90king
16th April 2009, 23:32
"We know that it is a politically delicate topic because Americans truly cherish their constitutional rights," Calderon said.


Rich
Wow, I actually agree with him! We do cherish our rights, we are Americans.

John
18th April 2009, 09:19
I just love it when a country can't solve its own problem and want another country to help (logical so far). What I hate is when one country is trying to solve its own problems by convincing another country to take measurements which (a) have been proven ineffective in the past, (b) are against the constitutional rights of the citizens of the other country and (c) are guaranteed to have no effects again, since any law affects only law-abiding citizens and not the outlaws.

Someone once said that "stupidity is doing the same thing again and again, hoping that different results will happen the next time", or something to that extend.

I was also amazed to see that Obama told to Calderon's face that he won't go for the AWB. I was expecting the worst, knowing what Calderon was going to ask. Interesting to say the least.

d90king
18th April 2009, 10:07
The sad part of this stuff in our country is that it appears that they are trying to use Transnationalism when they cant get the support here in the USA. They look at ways to usurp the Congress and the SCOTUS in order to implement their agendas.

Keep in mind that the UN want to have NO firearms in the hands of private citizens globally. George Sorros is one of the biggest supporters of this measure and gives large amounts of money to try and get his ideology's implemented.

Tonka
19th April 2009, 17:32
I expect that Obama will not push for an AWB, but if one makes it to his desk it will be signed in record time.

I believe that our real danger here is not one sweeping measure, but more of the same old incrementalism that 2A opponents have employed for years.